Loading ...Main Stream Media May be Slowly Starting to Walk it All Back
This article from a Canadian MSM Outlet The National Post is starting to subtly question the PCR Tests …regarding “Cycle Threshold” that we have been discussing here for many months.
The Headline is Good ( but some of the contents seem to stray off point IMO )
When is a case of COVID still COVID? Critics suggest the gold-standard of testing could be too sensitive
Here are some of the HIGHLIGHTS I am Highlighting or Questioning
1…The likelihood of the person still being infectious can decrease with more cycles, because the test — reverse transcription polymerase chain reaction, or RT-PCR — is so sensitive it can pick up debris from an old infection. The test can be positive even after someone has cleared the live organism.
YAY !!
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2…But RT-PCR is a binary yes/no test. No, negative. Yes, positive. Mina and others say it’s not so neat. “We have to stop thinking of people as positive or negative,” he said in an interview published in Science magazine this week, “and ask how positive?”
The concern is that some people are being ordered to isolate who are no longer infectious or a threat to public health, and that provinces are encouraging mass testing using a hyper-sensitive test that’s churning out daily cases numbers, the implication being that a case always equals an active infection equals a person capable of spreading to others.
YESSS !!
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3…“We do know that PCR picks up dead organism that is not infectious,” says Dr. Vanessa Allen, chief of medical microbiology at Public Health Ontario. “I think a lot of the discussion is, do we in fact need a test that’s so sensitive, and what is the meaning of those tests at the very end threshold? Are they actually the people we need to isolate?”
In Canada, most labs set the limit of cycles to detect the virus’ genetic material, or RNA, to between 35 and 40 cycles, though some Ontario labs have “positivity” cut-offs as high as 45 cycles, according to a study first flagged by Westphalian Times. Mina, a physician and epidemiologist, thinks the cut-off should be closer to 30. (The number of cycles to detect RNA is known as the cycle threshold, or CT value.)
Some researchers have reported that people may not be contagious if it takes more than 25 cycles to find the virus. Science magazine this week pointed to a study in Clinical Infectious Diseases, where researchers examined 3,790 samples that tested positive for the SARS-CoV-2 virus that causes COVID. They found 70 per cent of samples with a cycle threshold of 25 or lower could be cultured, meaning grown in a lab, meaning they were live, viable viruses, and the people were likely infectious. Only three per cent of cases with cycle thresholds above 35 could be cultured. While the authors cautioned it should not change public health policy, the work seems to confirm that high cycle thresholds — the more “enhancing” needed — the lower the viral loads.
Wooooohooo !
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4…A recent investigation by the New York Times found that in Massachusetts and New York, more than half of infections identified by PCR testing had cycle threshold values in the mid-to-upper 30s, indicating low viral counts. “Although such low counts could imply either an early or a late stage infection, the long duration of the RNA-positive tail suggest that most infected people are being identified after the infectious period has passed,” Mina and colleagues write this week in the New England Journal of Medicine . (People usually have a higher amount of virus in their bodies at the beginning of an infection, and it tails off).
“Crucially for the economy, it also means that thousands of people are being sent into 10-day quarantines after positive RNA tests, despite having already passed the transmissible stage of infection,” they write.
Hallaliueia !!!
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5…“Is it accurate to say that if you have somebody who has a CT value higher than 25 that they are less likely to be infectious? Yeah, that is accurate,” Bullard says. It’s also possible they could be infectious, though the probability decreases the higher the numbers of cycles you go.
Bullaaaard Bullaaaard Bullaaaaard Bullaaaard !!
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6…Any virus that’s being picked up beyond 25 cycles is probably left over genetic material from dead virus, Bullard says. “But that doesn’t mean it’s a false positive, or that it’s not important to find people, still.” Regardless of the number of cycles, RT-PCR has a 99.8 per cent specificity, meaning it is hugely unlikely to show a false positive, or tag someone without the virus as having the virus.
“These people may have had the disease for two weeks or more, in which case, well, are we overcalling it? No, because they still were a case — we still have to track down all of their contacts from when they earlier had the disease,” Bullard says
Bullard Sucks Bullard Sucks !! I protest !
a…This is BS…MOST of the tests as stated in this article pick up the virus AFTER 25 cycles ( they go on and on up to 45 cycles!)…so most of the tests are picking up old debris and these patients are NOT infected and should be left alone…they do not have a disease and they most likely never did. IF you are asymptomatic by definition you do not have a disease AND the WHO and others have said Asymptomatic people very rarely spread the disease…so why the Eff is it important to find these people Mr Bullard ? Are you going to back and contact trace all their contacts for the last many months ? sheesh
b…99.8% Specificity ? That means only 2 out of 1000.. How do you know that >? Show us how you determined that number. I have read studies that show 99.2% all the way down to 95.6 % ( 44 out of 1000). You need to show how this number was derived to have any credibility IMO.
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7…There is no controversy when testing people with symptoms of COVID. And, when faced with a global disaster, it’s important every rock is uncovered, says Allen, of Public Health Ontario. The COVID virus can be hard to grow, so lab cultures may not be a great proxy for infectiousness in humans.
“If there is a signal of genetic material of the virus, we can’t ignore that,” Allen says. The majority of positive cases are detected after very reasonably low cycles, she says.
Boooooooooooooo !
From this same Article Dr. Allen speaks with forked tongue .
“We do know that PCR picks up dead organism that is not infectious,” says Dr. Vanessa Allen, chief of medical microbiology at Public Health Ontario….
and….”According to Public Health Ontario data provided to the National Post, of 866 positive tests from Sept. 1 to Sept. 28, 35 per cent required 30 to 40 cycles. Roughly 16 per cent needed 35 to 40. The data doesn’t account for all positive tests, and only involves tests conducted by Public Health Ontario.”
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8…But borderline cases do happen, and there’s debate over whether COVID tests should come back with the cycle threshold value, instead of simply negative, or positive. Allen’s network of labs has begun to report a cycle threshold above 35 as “low level positivity.”
It won’t change the public health response. There would be no recommendation that those people shouldn’t isolate, “unless, let’s say, they go back and find out their symptoms started three weeks ago,” Allen says. According to current guidelines people no longer have to isolate if at least 10 days have passed since the start of symptoms.
Wow ….so She admits anyone who’s test is only positive after 25 cycles is likely over the disease as they are picking up dead virus but they still need to isolate …thats dumb
UNLESS…they are 10 days after the symptoms started. ( This is news to me..GOOD NEWS)
And WHO determines when the symptoms ( if any) started…The “Patient” that’s who)
So Fullgoldcrown you tested positive on a PCR test at 35 cycles so you need to isolate for 10 days unless your symptoms started 10 days or mor ago.
Well Doctor I did sneeze a couple times two weeks ago..can i go now ?
sheesh…this BS is just a bunch of arbitrary rules made up by these Public Health Covidiots
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9…In Ontario, fewer than 50 per cent of PCR tests results are being delivered within two days. Does that worry Allen? “Absolutely, absolutely.” The provincial COVID-19 testing network led by Ontario Health received more than 47,000 tests Wednesday alone. “The volumes are much higher than what we currently have capacity for
Bingo…so what is the point of testing at all ?
It takes days to get a result and while all these 47,000 are waiting for a result…technically You should be Locking them down …just in case ..right ?
And if you find 600 cases from 47,000 tests ( AS YOU HAVE BEEN OF LATE ) and these 600 are walking around for a couple of days…you are shit out of luck…right ?
Plus at a false positive rate of 1% * well above the average for Specificity… 470 cases will be false positives.
CONCLUSION…THIS IS ALL FOR NOTHING …THE TESTING AND TRACING IS A SCAM…IT ACCOMPLISHISHES NOTHING BUT COMPLETELY DISRUPTS ALL OUR LIVES AND DESTROYS BUSINESSES AND JOBS…FOR NOTHING !!
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HERE ARE SOME OTHER LINKS EMBEDDED IN THIS ARTICLE FOR YOU TO PERSUE…THEY ALL HELP TO MAKE THE CASE THAT THE PCR TEST WHICH CONTROLS OUR LIVES IS A LOT OF BUNK ! GOOD FOR THE NATIONAL POST OF CANADA TO BE PUTTING THESE ARTICLES OUT
TEST RESULTS SHOULD INCLUDE CYCLE THRESHOLD USED TO DETECT YOU POSITIVE RESULT
DONT GET TESTED IF YOU HAVE NO SYMPTOMS
https://nationalpost.com/health/test-reset-why-experts-say-you-shouldnt-show-up-for-covid-testing-if-you-are-asymptomatic?video_autoplay=true
COVID VACCINES ARE BEING DEVELOPED AT A RAPID PACE AND THAT IS A SERIOUS CONCERN
https://nationalpost.com/health/covid-19-vaccines-are-being-developed-at-record-pace-and-thats-a-serious-concern-for-people?video_autoplay=true
LAB STUDY COULD NOT GROW VIRUS FROM POSITIVE MOST TEST SAMPLES IMPLIES NOT INFECTIVE
https://academic.oup.com/cid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/cid/ciaa638/5842165
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